ļ»æEP #16 - Your Fertility Expert Team - Meet Helen Yii
[00:00:00] Tanja: Hello and a very warm welcome to today's show. This show today is going to be a really interesting conversation with my dear colleague Helen Yii. Helen has joined our team back in August 2018 and she has been working as a counsellor in our team since then. I'm really curious to learn how Helen takes her approach to help all these couples that are navigating their fertility journey. So sit back and relax and enjoy the show.
[00:01:11] Okay, well, a very warm welcome to the podcast today, Helen. I'm so excited to have you here. Me too. It's so great that you took the time to join me, and before we dive into more conversations about what you do and how you came about to become a fertility counsellor, I just wanted to ask you, like, what's your favorite morning ritual in the morning? How do you get yourself launched into the day?
[00:01:40] So for me, will get up about 7am or 7:30am. Then I will just take a cup of tea or coffee and I will just read a book for about half an hour. Then have a bit of quiet time for another 10 to 15 minutes before I go to my daily activities.
[00:02:01] Wow, that sounds like a really serene start into the morning. I can truly feel it.
[00:02:07] Yeah, yeah. Because I think it's important just to get my bearings right and I also like to do some planning, like to see what do I need to do for the day and just in case I miss out anything, you know. Yeah.
[00:02:22] Yeah, absolutely. studies show how important it is to get yourself on the right foot into the day and to enhance your productivity as well as your focus, your energies and everything. So it sounds like you're ticking all the boxes here.
[00:02:41] Yeah, certain days I will miss a bit here and there, but I will try my best to achieve that. Yes, of course, it's just life. So for those who don't know you yet, Helen, can I just ask you to introduce yourself and share a little bit more about your background?
[00:03:04] Yeah. So I'm a Singaporean now. I just received my citizenship recently. I received my musical training at the University of Melbourne and completed a graduate diploma in education after that. And following my university studies, I spent three decades teaching piano. And throughout my teaching career, I've also provided counselling to many students and also including the parents, helping them, coaching them how to navigate the challenges as the children growing up. Additionally, I also help some couples in their relationship issues. So basically it's a bit of family related difficulties that I tend to navigate to help people in that area.
[00:03:58] Yes, thank you for sharing that. And I remember when we first met and you were sharing about that you were a piano teacher for so many years and you were already volunteering back then as helping youth, right?
[00:04:15] Yes, So I have been volunteering in my church community to many individuals and couples, you know, just give them some advice and ideas of what to do and how to cope with bringing up their children.
[00:04:34] Yeah, wonderful. That's so beautiful to hear that. Yes, I always feel so inspired by those that are doing volunteering. It's such a beautiful thing and way on how to give back to community as well. What prompted you or inspired you to actually then eventually move into the fertility counselling space?
[00:05:00] Yeah, so that is a very interesting story. So, you know, my children, I have three children. So my eldest daughter being girl, she's very talkative and, you know, caring for the mother. And she has been observing me and she is asking me like, you know, mom, can see that you are helping a lot in the church, you know, to various people. And then one day she said, you know, do you really know what you're doing?
Or is there any other further ways where you can enhance your skills or your abilities in helping people? So her question has really prompted me to reflect much more in terms of how I can grow in this field. And this helped me to realize that indeed I do need to pursue deeper knowledge. And that's what triggers me to pursue a master's in counselling in Monash University eight years ago and to deepen my expertise in this area.
[00:06:06] Yes. I was actually looking at the records here and then I saw that you actually joined us in August 2018, so coming to seven years, isn't that just amazing how time is flying. Yeah, correct. Time is just flying.
[00:06:31] Yeah. How thoughtful of your daughter actually too. I'm really surprised. Yeah. She was just a teenager at that time. Yeah. So we should listen to our children, right?
[00:06:47] Absolutely. And also you actually showing what a role model mom can be, right? Because you then took up another masters in counselling to give your career another switch then. It's simply amazing.
[00:07:05] Exactly. Yeah. So I know that you are a very compassionate counsellor because that's one of your super talents. I think I don't know anybody who is so naturally compassionate like you, Helen, in our team.
Thank you. Thank you.
[00:07:23] And I always mentioned that, right? So I was wondering in your day-to-day work, when you see couples or your clients struggling with the fertility challenges that can sometimes take twists and turns in their life, how do you ensure that you can bring the same compassion to each of them?
[00:07:45] Yeah, so this is a very important question. Where the deep, compassionate and listening ear, which I feel is very important. So I will prioritize a safe and non-judgmental space in hearing them and understanding them. So I have been trying to really exercise to myself in terms of the deep listening to engage with the client in terms of not just listening to their words, but actually the underlying messages. What are they really wanting to communicate? And even as a couple, when they communicate with me, the husband and wife can speak different language actually, even the same words the meaning can be different. So I have to be very sensitive to hear them each individually. And then as a couple, yeah.
[00:08:41] Yeah, absolutely. For those that maybe haven't experienced couple counselling or individual counselling, can you maybe share a little bit more about what could be benefits for a couple to see you together as a couple instead of seeing you one-on-one?
[00:09:02] Yeah, so for couple counselling that I have been conducting, usually for the first session, I will encourage them to do it as a couple. And then subsequently, I'll encourage for individual session with the wife and then with the husband. And then we will have a co-joined session again for the subsequent one, probably one, two, three, fourth, the fourth session. Yeah. So that this will give each individual an open space to voice their inner thoughts, inner concerns, which will be interrupted if you have your partners there. So that we can really dive deep into the issues that they are facing without any interruptions during the individual sessions.
[00:09:50] Yeah. And I think it's so important, like what you say, to create that space for them actually to get like a safe place and a confidential space where they can open up about maybe things that they wouldn't do if the partner is sitting next to them.
[00:10:08] Yes, yeah. I think the idea of no interruption thoughts and expression is very important because our thoughts can be easily distracted by any kinds of message or ideas that come along the way and it just blocks the deep thoughts that actually is there and then you can't draw them out eventually, which is a waste of time. Yeah.
[00:10:36] Absolutely agree. Yes. And what has been your experience so far as working in the space of fertility counselling?
[00:10:46] So my experience has been challenging, especially in the beginning. It was not so easy to try to get to know the dynamics of the couple and to know what are they really facing that I could bring some benefits in their couple relationship. So the idea is to really understand and listen carefully and also to give them space talk without any judgment. So what I heard from a couple before and the next couple, it can be the same words, but it can mean different things. So always come in with a new set of mind, with a new sheet of thinking and to help this couple to maneuver in their IVF or fertility journey.
[00:11:40] Yeah, and that's so right what you're saying. And it's really down again to really listen very carefully of what they share with you in that moment, isn't it? words can be very, very powerful, but so can silence.
[00:11:56] Yes, yeah. And also sometimes we can also draw them up by asking them questions, more open-ended questions, and to help them to reflect and to see where, what would they want to do about it, or is there something that they are unsure or uncertain, yeah. So to offer more ideas for them.
[00:12:22] Yeah, absolutely. Have you ever experienced a client that was adamant to actually wanting to embrace any of these questions or reflections?
[00:12:34] Oh yes, yeah. I do have clients say, I don't need anything. You know, I'm fine, I'm good. So when such things happen, I respect their privacy or their mindset. I think the idea is to let them know that whenever they feel that they need help, they can always come back again. Yeah, so I don't really push the button, you know, when they are not ready. And so I respect.
Each individual's mindset and their emotional space at that time. Because I think counselling is a collaboration effort. And as a counsellor, I'm always be there to be ready to listen and not to push someone when they are still thinking, maybe he or she is still thinking and they are still having some something holding them back and they are not quite ready to open up or to move forward to make the change.
[00:13:36] Yes. And that's simply how respectful it is in that collaboration, right? What are the challenges that you have seen maybe on the mental and emotional side that couples that are on an IVF journey are particularly facing?
[00:13:57] Yeah. So the most important or common struggles that couples face is anxiety, particularly around the uncertainties of the outcome of the treatments. You know, we are very goal-oriented. We like to know all the numbers. The results, so inevitably couples who are drawn to want to know what is happening. Is it successful? Is it good?
What is the quality of my eggs or embryos or sperms, everything. So another important challenge that I face is the grief and loss, especially when they experience miscarriage or fail IVF attempts or simply just could not get eggs or sperm that the doctor desires. So this can be very disappointing and frustrating for the couples.
And at that stage as a counsellor, I can feel helpless. Yeah. I can only support them emotionally, in terms of medically and physically, it's beyond me. It's not within my control. Yes. Yeah.
[00:15:10] So how do you work to help these couples? Do you sometimes also work together with an IVF doctor or with other therapists together with the client?
[00:15:23] Yeah. So with such cases, I was also checking with the doctors as well to see what is the current state and also to see how my best expertise and skills can match together to help the couple to navigate through this very challenging period of their lives with empathy and practical tools. And the main thing is for the couple during this stage is to just to listen and to engage with them, empowering them, validate their feelings, to know that whatever they feel is true, you know, and that I'm always here to support them.
So we'll also highlight communication skills with the couple that they should not neglect communication, to continue to hold each other's hand, whether they go through the mountains or whether they go through the valleys, they should be always behind each other in supporting one another. So those will be the main message that I will instill to the couple to go through this stage of their lives.
[00:16:36] Yes, and it can sometimes be very challenging, especially for men, because all what they feel is like that doctors and nurses and whoever is involved in them, especially in IVF, are talking to their female partner, right? Because it's all about the wife that actually goes through the procedures. She goes through hormone stimulation. She goes to all these medications. And men can sometimes feel, be left behind. Yeah, not being inside of it. Yes. I that's such an important message that you convey to them to be like hold each other's hand.
[00:17:17] Yes, indeed, the men and the women do respond differently due to our biological, emotional and social factors. But nonetheless, I will also highlight this to make them be aware. You'll be surprised. Sometimes they don't even realize why they behave the way they behave. And the fact that we point that out, it will give them a deeper understanding of each other.
And that will really help to reduce the misunderstanding, the miscommunication, and even eventually the conflict in the relationship. And this will really help. Because especially in the Asian society, women do face a lot of social pressure and stigma in this aspect. And it's very hard for women to express whatever they go through. And also for men tend to be emotionally distancing.
Most of the men, not all the men. So sometimes it can be seen as they are not involved, but actually they are involved in it. It's just they don't know how to do it. So all they are doing in their way, so things like that. A lot of things that we want to bring that out in terms of how men and women behave differently and how we can align together. So I think go through fertility struggles. If you don't understand how men and women behave, can be a real huge struggle.
[00:18:48] Absolutely, totally agree. You also mentioned something before about grief and loss. And for many people who maybe are not aware so much about that topic, they would identify grief and loss with the loss of a loved one in prison or as a pet. But indeed, in infertility, we talk a lot about the sense of loss, not having those follicles that are growing or not having healthy embryos after a hormone stimulation or not experiencing a pregnancy after embryo transfer. How do you help clients during such a phase when they experience such a deep loss and grief?
[00:19:38] Yeah, so when couples are going through this very huge sense of anxiety and uncertainties, our first is to acknowledge their emotional feelings that is, you know, really can be roller coaster, one day is good and another day is bad, that kind of feelings, is to help them to identify and challenge the negative thought patterns and how we can work together to reduce these feelings of helplessness or the overwhelmed feelings that is around them using different techniques like cognitive behaviour therapy, CPT or emotionally focused therapy, EFT or acceptance and commitment therapy, ACT. So various techniques for different strategies for different clients.
[00:20:33] I'll also emphasise the importance of self-compassion and resilience and to support the clients to be kind to themselves. Because we can only know this much things. The universe is much more than what is beyond us. So let go and let the doctors, let the nurses or any medical team that can come and help you. And also the universe will also help you in enabling you to move. through this process. So not just look into like with a tunnel vision. So the idea is to let go. And another way is to again emphasize the couples is to encourage open communication between partners. Because I think being supportive of each other in this very challenging journey will help the couples to maintain this relationship.
The emotional balance and the relationship in growing deeper. That of the relationship is not just subjected to the outcome of the IVF. So the depth of the relationship is based on the experiences that both experience together as a couple.
[00:21:57] So, well, you can say it's easier to say than done, right? Which is true, but this is the truth.
The truth is that we should hold each other's hand, no matter where we are at. And to trust each other to continue to lean on each other's back during this journey.
[00:22:22] Beautiful Helen and I can truly see the approach that you are taking in your sessions. Is there a particular experience or a story that is very close to your heart that you may want to share with us?
[00:22:39] Yes, yeah. So in my course of counselling, so many couples, I can't remember how many hundreds. A particularly memorable, meaningful experience for me was when I worked with a couple in their mid-30s who were undergoing IVF. They actually had a first child and that they are actually planning for the second one. And they have faced years of emotional strain, unable to conceive a second child. And the woman was really shattered when she found out that she was actually dealing with premature menopause symptoms in her body, which she didn't even realize. So their desire to grow their family was so strong, and that's why they have become very hopeless and isolated to each other.
[00:23:38] So throughout the session, when I first heard about them, we focused on improving their communication. Yeah, because due to managing work with a child and family stress with expectations, existing do well with the couple's relationship. So I encourage them to foster emotional resilience through couple relationship in terms of communication. And to address their fears, to address their disappointments together as a couple. So we have a few couple sessions together. Just to hear the husband's point of view, to hear the wife's point of view, and also to see how they can work together as a team. So that took a number of sessions actually to help them to feel more connected.
[00:24:31] And later on when she was ready for the embryo transfer, the universe enable them to have first successful embryo transfer. That's beautiful. But not long after that, she has many occasions of threatened miscarriages. And that's where she got back to me again. Her fears came back again. So we started to have multiples of sessions going through the months of her pregnancies. Yeah, so this journey became even more impactful when through the counselling sessions with the couples eventually enabled them to successfully conceive a child, a baby boy.
So through this coaching session with this couple, it has just reaffirmed to me that how important it is to support a couple during a difficult journey together. And reminded me that I'm so passionate about helping these couples navigating through the very complex time of fertility and emotionally up and down. It's really rewarding. It was not easy, but it was really rewarding.
[00:25:55] Yes. And thanks so much for elaborating into this because it shows that, yes, the relationship can start off before they actually conceive through pregnancy as well as after birth, maybe because some of our clients, we continue to see even after postpartum when they have their baby in their arms. And maybe some of the challenges are in you that come to them or they can change or just transform.
[00:26:29] Yes, correct. You know, Tanya, I think one of the key things that in my counselling, as I gather my experiences, is that there are three key areas that I'm trying to build with them. I've summarised as building bridges, creating connections, whether emotionally or giving information during the counselling sessions.
My goal is to help them to move forward through the challenges journey. So the tricky areas that I would like to build is to connect with one's self, with the past experiences. Then it's to connect with the loved ones, that means the people around them. Then the third, which is the connection with the present situations. So each of these bridges needs to be strengthened and in order for them to successfully able to feel the balance and the clarity as they move forward. So this will be sort of my guiding principles in dealing with my clients.
[00:27:41] Yes, thank you so much for sharing this. How is it for you, like what you just were sharing now with dealing also with such an intensity sometimes and also challenging situations? How do you practice self-care?
[00:27:58] Yes, yeah, my self-care, is so important. I got asked this question many times, even by my friends. They are concerned about my work as well. So for me, to avoid burnout, I need to be mindful to stay balanced, to prioritize my own self-care. The first thing that I would like to do is to maintain clear boundaries between my professional and my personal life. So I take time to decompress and reflect after each session. So usually I would just, if the session is too intense, I would just sit quietly and I'll just go out for a walk or listen to music.
And I also think that engaging in supervision and peer support groups like what we usually do during a monthly session, which I feel is very useful and helpful in helping me to have my self-care as well.
[00:29:08] Yes, thank you. Thanks for sharing that. And I think it's so, so important, like what you said, to really take the time to reflect and to sit quietly, which many people don't do nowadays anymore, right? Yes. Everyone is so busy.
[00:29:22] Yeah, yeah. What would be your best piece of advice to those that are maybe listening and have been considering about seeing a counsellor or not for their fertility journey in terms of how they could take the next step?
[00:29:44] Yeah, I think if you are considering something and you're unsure whether you should do or you should not do, I'll say just do it. You know, just do it because I think counselling can really help you to gain knowledge and also to gain understanding of what is to come. And I feel knowledge is power. Yeah. And you may find out more information that you have never known as well.
Yes, AI can tell you a lot of things, but AI can't feel your feelings and feel your emotions, right, Tanya? So I'll say, take the first step. The first step is the hardest step. And even if your first step is a wrong step, it's still okay. But at least you try. What if the first step is the best step? And it may encourage you with multiple steps, right? Yeah.
[00:30:41]So I said, Just do it and seeking help or talk to someone, doesn't show your weakness. Actually, it's a strength. You need a lot of courage. You need a lot of power to meet someone, to talk to someone. So I would say, take your time out, you know, just spend 45 minutes, talk to someone with all the thoughts, questions that you may have, fears that you may have, worries that you may have and you'll be surprised how much you can learn and grow or find out for yourself.
[00:31:21] Maybe it's also worth sharing at this point that what I usually motivate my clients who are not sure whether or not to take up counselling is to schedule for a discovery call, which is usually free. It's 50% where you can connect with a coach or a counsellor to see whether there is this magic match. And if there is no, then just go with someone else. I usually really also motivate my clients to do two to three such discovery calls because it's super, super important and we can't emphasize enough on this to find the right person.
Yeah, absolutely. And what would be your advice to someone who's maybe listening and has been thinking about the change of career, but hasn't gotten to that final point of decision, whether or not to take up a master's in counselling or a diploma in counselling and whether or not to dive into fertility related counselling? Is there anything that you would share from your experience?
[00:32:36] Yeah, if you are thinking about doing counselling course, then maybe you should talk to one of us and to find out more and also maybe to find out, ask yourself, why do you want to do counselling and how would that benefit you in your career or in your life as a whole? Yeah, so I think to find out more, to read up more, to talk to people, know, all these various ways to confirm your calling.
[00:33:09] Exactly. And reach out to us. If you're listening now and you don't know whether or not you should actually do such a transformational switch, then just send us a message or reach out to us as Helen said. My last question to you, Helen, is like, if you were to have a full day to yourself, what would you do on that day?
[00:33:36] That would be my luxury day. Yeah, so I will probably, you know, go to a nature park to walk because I love nature. I like just the quietness, you know, look at the green trees, a bit of bird chirping somewhere. And then I will read a book in a cafe with aircon and drink coffee or my favourite food. So I think it will be a bit outdoor, a bit indoor. Indoor will be a bit of cooking. I enjoy cooking with the new recipes, whether cookies or bread or something like that. So those are my relaxation days.
[00:34:23] Yes, I just wanted to say it sounds super relaxing. Thank you so, so much, Helen, to share your experience, but also your wisdom today and the many, many good and kind thoughts that you are bringing into counselling and touching the hearts of so many people. Thank you for being here today and taking the time.
[00:34:47] It's my pleasure, Tanya. Such a great honor. Thank you for inviting me. Thank you.
[00:34:56] Wow, wasn't that just such a beautiful, beautiful conversation. I really love talking to Helen because there is so much kindness in her words. Each time I walk away feeling so inspired and there is so much love and kindness that she emphasizes in her conversations. It's also true and it's the authentic her.
It's like how I have known Helen for so many years. So I hope that this conversation has instilled some inspiration in you, whether it was the kindness of her words, her calm and beautiful tone that she has in her voice, or whether maybe some of the experiences that she shared touched you as well, whether it's for you or whether it's for someone else that you maybe know that could benefit from hearing and listening to Helen's approach. So thank you for being here today and taking the time to listen to us and hopefully I'll see you next week again.
